PODCAST: How to Find Your Calling

Jeshua:

Hey there, podcast listeners. You're listening to Frequentsee Conversations, the podcast about the kingdom of God invading every space in every way. I'm your host, Jeshua, sitting down with Julian and Katia Adams, the directors of Frequentsee. And in today's episode, we're talking about calling. We answer questions around parenting and how you can raise up your children to know their calling in God and pursue it. And then Julian and Katia talk about their own individual journeys in finding their calling. How they knew it was God and what steps they took to see their calling fulfilled. It's an awesome episode. If you have ever wondered how to find your own calling, this is a great episode for you. Hope you enjoy.

Jeshua:

All righty. Here we are, another episode of Frequentsee Conversations. This is going to be a super fun one. Just to start off, we're going to go ahead and jump right into a question from one of our partners. Her name is Natalie, and she has a question for you guys. Julian and Katia about calling and parenting and how to raise your kids into their calling. And so let's just dive right into it. Here's our question from Natalie.

Natalie:

Hi, Julian and Katia. My question would be around parenting. Julian made a comment in one of his videos that when he was three or four years old, he got filled with the Holy Spirit. We are parents to a two and six year old. Is there something that your parents did, perhaps, that really helped you guys step into that space? Was there stuff that they did practically? And is there stuff that you've learned from them that you've been able to take to the next level? And I'd really like my children to just bring heaven down, even just in our living room and all the things that you can share with us that have young children and that are wanting them to almost run ahead of where we were. That would be my question. Thanks so much.

Jeshua:

So, thank you, Natalie, for your question. That was really great. Let's jump into it.

Katia:

Yeah, I love that question.

Julian:

I mean, I think for me, in terms of my sense of call, it's important to note that effectively, God began to speak to my parents, some prophetic promises about me before I was even born, which is really, really cool because then you get to steward in the sense of what God is doing in a particular child. And I'd encourage you, we're doing this with our kids. We are treasuring prophetic promises about our children. And whilst we're not forcing them to do anything to make that happen, what we are doing is praying those things into their life. I just got to help them go to the next level in terms of their own relationship with Jesus. For me, I got filled with the spirit at the end of my third year, beginning of my fourth year. I can't exactly remember when, on my mom and dad's bed.

Julian:

I think the first thing to remember is they expected that, as children, we would experience the Holy Spirit. That was a given, "God is going to meet with our kids and so when we pray for them, we should expect for Holy Spirit to come." I think sometimes parents do the kind of cute little thing where we go, "Oh, Lord Jesus, please bless our little Johnny." And actually, rather than believing with full expectation that when we pray, something's going to happen. And so there's no junior Holy Spirit. They get the fullness of God in the same way that an adult does. So I think my parents expected that. And then when they prayed for me, they expected that God would fill me and I'd speak in tongues. And so that was really cool, just to be able to receive that and encounter that in terms of their faith levels, their expectations.

Julian:

I think it is good to know that not all of my siblings had the same encounter. So there wasn't an expectation in the sense of, you must do it this way. It was patient at each child's own developmental progress with God and their own developmental encounter with God. I think I was aware from a very young age, of God's presence. And I think my parents recognized that and joined their faith where I was growing God and helped facilitate that and nurture that. I think that's an important thing to recognize that not every child is going to have the same timeline, same encounter and that somewhere along the line you have to learn how to recognize what God is doing in your child and then join your faith to help lead them into an encounter.

Julian:

I think the other thing that my parents did really well was, I suppose, to help identify what God was saying to me and through me and then adding their kind of wisdom, their kind of the sense of, this is God. They celebrated when God was speaking. It wasn't just, again, that kind of dismissive, sweet, that's lovely. But then they actually had, "Julian. What is God saying to you? What are you feeling about this?" It wasn't just a dismissive dynamic, but an invocation of dynamic to process with them around what I was feeling God doing. And then the last thing and then obviously Katia can, maybe jump in, in terms of where we're at. Is my parents exposed to ministries that moved in power. So, from a young age, I was going to healing ministries way past my big time.

Julian:

And obviously my parents had to juggle the wisdom of that in terms of it was going to benefit me with school and learning and getting good rest. But they did take me into meetings and into contacts, and they did introduce me to people who were moving in the things of the Spirit, who were doing amazing things for God. So I saw firsthand, the presence of God moving in incredible ways. They had a voracious appetite for the presence and power of God. And God was moving. We were sure to be queuing up in meetings, waiting to get in. We would get there early, I think I still have a problem with that now. I'm like, "Let's get there early so we can get a seat."

Katia:

We might talk about that right now.

Julian:

I think there is something put before me to express hunger by posturing yourself for the presence of God and expect God can move and go to the places where God was moving.

Katia:

Yeah. I love this question. Both in terms of how do you encourage your children towards hunger for the Spirit, which I think is what Natalie was asking. And it's just such a great question. And in terms of where we're taking it even further, in terms of how to encourage your kids in the calling that you know God has for them. My story growing up is similar to Julian's in some ways in terms of my parents definitely were open with their expectation that God wants to meet with us as children. And I love that, because that expectation created an expectation in my own heart. "Oh, if my parents think that this is normal for me to meet with God, then I guess it's normal for me to meet with God." And and we as parents have the unique privilege of creating for our children what normal expectations are and what normal culture looks like. That's our unique privilege. And so kind of growing up in that environment, that expectation, it made it easy for me to expect that God wanted to speak to me because my parents were very clear with that.

Katia:

I was saying to Julian earlier, as children, I remember having devotions with my parents and they would invite each of us, I was young six, seven, eight. We would all read our kind of Bible readings for that day separately and then we'd come together and my parents would ask me as a six year old, "Now, what did God speak to you about?" In the same way that they would share what God had spoken to them about. If that's done well, that really can create a culture where your children recognize, "Wait, my parents think that God can speak to me with the same value on that as God speaks to them." And it is an honor. You're just a child you don't really understand, but rather, when God speaks to you, whether you're six or sixty, it's valuable. And we're really going for that in our own family of wanting our kids to recognize that when God speaks to them, it is just as valid, just as powerful, just as valuable as when God speaks to us.

Katia:

And the other thing really that we're wanting to do, that alongside that with our kids is ask them questions when they speak about encounters that they're having or things that they're seeing that aren't questions of skepticism, but questions of curiosity. If we as parents ask skeptical questions... And sometimes we can be drawn to do that because we want to make sure that our kids learn well and aren't deceived and don't make things up. And so we start being a little bit skeptical. "Did you really see that?" But as soon as we say things like that, it shuts down the child's confidence in seeing because they start doubting themselves.

Katia:

And so, Julian and I are really aware of this with our kids. Both of our children are quite sensitive to the supernatural. Both of them see things in the spirit that you can't see with the natural eye. And we've been very careful with this, not by any means perfect, but we are careful and aware of this that we don't want to ask questions of our kids that's like, "Did you really see that? Was that thing really there? Was there really an angel in the corner?" But rather, "What did the angel look like? What did you see? I want to learn from you." Because as we do that, our children grow in confidence to have encounters, knowing that we believe them now, that we believe that they can see because they can. Children were born with the innate ability to see the things of God just as you and I were. And so we're aware of that.

Katia:

And in terms of calling and taking it to that level, my parents were great. Like Julian's were, of really valuing the prophetic that was spoken over my life, of reminding me of the prophetic, of giving me a value for the prophetic. And so I remember being a child of seven or eight and having a journal where I would write prophecies that people spoke over me because I was given a value for the prophetic. I still have prophecies that were given to me when I was a young child and value them and pray over them even now, because some of the things that were prophesied over me when I was seven or eight is stuff that I'm only just beginning to walk into now. And so I think that's a really powerful thing to give your children a value for the prophetic words spoken over them. So that they can start stepping into what God has spoken over them in terms of calling and destiny. And they can use those prophetic words as a road map, really, for their destiny and calling. And it's incredibly powerful to do that.

Julian:

Yeah, I think ultimately the thing that is super important too around helping develop the call in your children as a parent is two levels. One, making the big steps of faith. You model what faith looks like. You model what following the call looks like.

Katia:

Now there is a challenge.

Julian:

And that is massive. But also you model processing disappointment. And I think both of our parents, really in many ways, did this well. There were times where it didn't work out and my parents didn't go, "Oh, there. Believe harder. You need to work hard." No. It was like, "This couldn't work out. We don't understand it, but we know God's good. So, we're going to go again. We're going to trust again." And I think living in that context of modeling faith and the call of God, I remember the transition when my dad left paid employment to go to into full time employment and sat us down to, "Guys, this is what I'm feeling. Do we have faith for this as a family? This is the call on us. Should we do this? What do you guys feel?" And inviting us into the journey of faith, following the call. Made it easier for me when I was in my 20s going, "Okay. I'm going to give up security and go on to the faith call just as soon as work for my dad and mom. So, it's going to work for me."

Julian:

And then having the sense of encouragement because of personal history as a family around big faith steps, hopping in cars and driving thousands of miles to get to where my dad was going to preach because there's a sense of call. It's like those kind of dynamic help us develop faith muscles together as a family. And I think certainly for us, we're in this major transition at the moment where we've moved from South Africa via England to the United States of America. And almost everything around us says, "Don't do this. This is not wise." But actually, we're following call together. And so, we're at making moments of pearls for our kids. We're making moments of celebrating the victories with our kids.

Julian:

So they sense the call and although they don't fully comprehend what's going on, what we're doing is giving them a sense of a memory bank of victory around how we're following our call, which ultimately is going to help unlock how they follow their call.

Katia:

And another thing I'm aware of for our children and again, this is by no means a claim that we're perfect on this. But just something that I'm aware of, is that the prophetic words that we have over them, already I'm starting to see their little personalities, how God has wired then kind of in line with those prophetic words. So for our daughter, there's lots of prophetic words over her about preaching and oh, my goodness, she is a communicator, isn't she?

Julian:

No doubt about what she wants, oh yes.

Katia:

And sometimes, as a parent, and I'm just being really honest here, there are moments where she's talking and talking and talking and I am craving, "Just give me some silence for a second. Stop talking at me." Is literally the thought that is in my head. And as a parent and every parent will know this moment where you have this moment where you can choose to say, to use their strength really as a negative in that moment, or to choose to pick up on the positive of that strength, knowing that in the future they're going to need repeated confidence sown in that strength. And so there's lots of moments where my daughter is talking and talking and talking away and all I want to say is, "Please stop." And sometimes I get this right. Sometimes I get this wrong. But in the right moments, I know those moments are the ones where I say, "Gosh, you are such a good communicator."

Katia:

Because I know, even now I am sowing into her, confidence for her call as a preacher. And those words of, "Gosh, you're such a good communicator," are going to build slowly but surely, a momentum of confidence that God put this in her. And for my son, we've got lots of words about him both being in the marketplace and being in ministry and being a businessman and being somewhat successful...

Julian:

Creative.

Katia:

...in kingdom ministry, in the marketplace. And my son is a negotiator.

Julian:

Oh, Lord have mercy.

Katia:

And that's a positive way to see that, because every parent listening will understand that being a negotiator sometimes isn't so much fun to parent.

Julian:

The questions.

Katia:

And again, in the moments where I get this right, I know that it's where I say, where I respond not with, "Stop asking me for the tenth time to do the thing the way you wanted me to do it." But rather is when I say to him, "My boy, you are you are gifted in negotiation. You are so strong at being able to keep asking and asking and not take no for an answer. And that is a God given thing." And I know that those moments are success moments, not because I had the right answer, but because I'm sowing into him confidence for the call of God overhead. And I think as parents, we have the power to do that, to keep filtering moments with our children, filtering their personalities through the call of God that we know, prophetically, over them and to keep sowing into them with our words, confidence for that call as we appreciate the strengths in their personalities.

Jeshua:

That's great. I love that. I've got another question from Michael which moves beyond kind of that childhood calling into your callings. This is a question from Instagram. He says, I would love to hear about each of your journeys around your respective callings. What has surprised you, marked you, challenged you, inspired you as you've journeyed in and towards what God is revealing and what he's called you to and how much of it has looked the way that you've expected? It's a good one, right?

Katia:

Oh my goodness, such a great question.

Natalie:

How do you conduct... [inaudible 00:17:59] it's a pretty plus years.

Katia:

I think what has surprised me has been the timing of the calling. As a child, I've got prophetic words. So I was kind of aware of what God wanted to do. Into my late teens, I became really aware of some of the purposes of God, particularly around ministry. In my early 20s, I became impatient about those words. And I remember getting this really, really helpful advice from my pastor at the time who said to me, "Katia, often the call of God is a marathon, not a sprint." And that kind of took me aback because kind of late teens, early 20s, I'm like, "Okay, let's get going. This is all the things that God has said. Surely he wants to do this in the next five minutes." And what surprised me about the call of God is that though he spoke about my calling even before my birth, but certainly in a very early childhood, it's taken a long time, 30 years for some of those words to start seeing fruition, let alone come into complete fruition.

Katia:

And that surprised me the most, that God isn't in a hurry, actually, to see that calling to come to pass, but is actually much more interested in drawing out the strengths of our character, of refining the weaknesses in our character. He's much more interested in drawing us into a journey that will deepen our intimacy with him. And in the process of that, bringing calling to fruition. I think, initially I thought the calling was God's aim. And increasingly, I'm not convinced it is. I think the calling is simply a byproduct on the journey of growing in depth with Jesus.

Katia:

And it was when I took my focus off, "These things must come to pass because Jesus promised them," to, "Okay, Jesus, you're my adventure." As I did that, slowly but surely, I became more and more the person that God created me to be in order to see the calling fulfilled. And the other thing I'd say, I know Julian you've got so much on this of your own journey, but for me about my calling, one thing I really want to say is when God calls you to something, nobody can close the door to that thing.

Katia:

And certainly my own journey in terms of ministry preaching, there were lots of moments where it looked incredibly unlikely that anybody was going to open a door for me to do those things because I wasn't in contexts that really believed a woman could do those things or should do those things. And yet, in those very contexts, God opened doors for me to preach and to teach and to train others up and to speak and to minister. And really throughout all of that, I see the faithful fingerprints of God where he who spoke is faithful to do it.

Katia:

And sometimes people ask me, I'm not in a context that allows me to do X, Y and Z or I'm not in a setting where I can see the calling of God come about. And I really want to say, if you feel like you're in the right context, where you feel faith for where you're at and the people you are journeying with, God who called you is faithful to open doors. You don't need to make those doors happen. You don't need to push doors, you don't need to push yourself into situations. But God is really good at accomplishing what he's promised. And that certainly would be my story. I look back at how I come to where we're at now. Some of the platforms that I'm so privileged and honored to get invited to speak on and I laugh because I never saw the trajectory in the way that God has done it. And yet here I am doing things that he promised.

Katia:

Even though in many steps in the journey, it certainly seemed unlikely but he's so good at opening doors that he wants opened.

Julian:

Yeah, I think for me, one of the things, as I look back, I am just the tender age of 41 now.

Katia:

Still so young. So young my love, I felt that pregnant pause waiting for me to say that.

Julian:

Lord Jesus. Thank you, darling. I've been in ministry now for over 22 years. Not that ministry equates to fulfilling my call. But I've realized something, in the Kingdom of God the important isn't always urgent. Sometimes, when you look at the life of Jesus, for 30 years there's just character formation happening in Jesus as he's growing in favor with God and with man. He is doing what is natural before he steps into the outrageous favor and call of God for the first 30 years of his life. That's what he sees, what is normal and what's expected of a Jewish man. I think it's really important to recognize that it feels like the life of Jesus, if it's a model for us, which it is, is God was more interested in forming character. And that was more important than simply getting to the cross. It was about formulating how he was going to represent his father on the Earth for the three years of ultimate outworking of the call. And then we see him stepping to the cross. I believe it is because there was a dynamic of God working character into him for the call.

Julian:

Like the life of Jesus lived on earth is not inconsequential. Now, I feel like sometimes in the Christian world we separate the physical life of Jesus around his own call and we apply that to our lives that only that which is spiritual is important. I'm learning that actually, no, that's not true. It is about formulating character that looks like representing the father well. It's about building interests, it's about living in the kingdom of God in a very real way, in a very practical way. That, often is what prepares you for the call more than anything else. It's about the relational difficulties, is about the highs and the lows, it's about all of that stuff.

Julian:

And then I look at how Jesus translates this to 12 men in under three years. And again, I think we place the emphasis on the spiritual moments recorded in scripture as the big moments for the disciples. Peter coming into a restoration moment or whatever the case might be. We put all of the emphasis there. But I think about three years of food and fun and drinking together and hanging out together and the long road trips from one place to the other. There was something happening in terms of the formation of the disciples there, that prepped them for their ultimate call beyond the high moments of miracles, beyond the high moments of fulfilling what we think is a spiritual call. And so, I think there's a lot more practicality, a lot more earthiness and a lot more not sweating the small stuff when it comes to the call of God.

Julian:

And that will be my experience, is that one of my great mentors, Jeff Kidwell, who is kind of one of the key guys who helped me understand this, was your day off and your fun is as important to God as all this spiritual stuff and that formulates dynamic in you for your call that's as important as what you're doing in your call. And so for me, I'm learning not to sweat the small stuff because God probably doesn't think of them as highly as you do. And I'm also learning that the ultimate expression of fulfilling your call is in God's moment of favor. I am not called to work for favor, I'm called to steward favor. That's a massive deal for me. I think I used to try and work for favor, like if I could network my way into my call. If I can just join the dots myself, I'll get there. But actually, that's not how the kingdom works.

Julian:

God provides favor, like Katia said that no man can stop. And if I can [inaudible 00:26:30] with that, I can increase that. And so, for me, I'm learning to, and we're learning to steward our favor. We get invited into all sorts of platforms, big platforms, little platforms. And sometimes we're learning that discerning where the favor is, is more important than the type of platform you're given. And as you steward that, that means sometimes means saying no to big platforms and yes to smaller platforms. It also, sounds as being saying yes to big platforms no to big platforms. I'm learning to steward the favor for the sake of the longevity of call. And working with that, I think the other thing that I wish I could tell myself as 20 year old, I became a church leader, church elder by the time I was 22. I was the youngest church elder in our movement at the time. I would tell myself, "Be a leader as a 22 year old."

Julian:

I tried to mature myself thinking that maturity was a certain type of leadership style rather than understanding as a 22 years old there's some things that I'm working through. There's still some things that I'm having to learn, having to process that, actually, will help me when I'm a 35 year old. And I think that was a big deal for me. I read, in retrospect, I'm going actually it's okay to process my aging stage well within the call of God, rather than denying my aging stage for the sake of what looks like maturity but actually comes across as immature at the end of day.

Julian:

So, following favor, being age appropriate to the call, allowing God to work things out in me in his own time, not sweating the small stuff. Understanding that the important doesn't always mean it's a 100% urgent and I need to follow it immediately. I actually go, "How does this work itself out?" And then I think, ultimately allowing, how do I say this, other than allowing the disappointment of call to work itself out to where I'm like [gung ho 00:28:43] and leadership doesn't deliver. I have issues with my church leadership that I don't know how to deal with. And what I do with that and how do I deal with disappointment when I make a step of faith and just fall flat.

Julian:

There was a season where my giving led me to debt. And going, "Actually, I need to stop. How do I deal with this?" Because I was trying to be so passionate about my call and trying to get myself into places of call and learning actually how to deal with the disappointment in call. I remember Jack Dear once saying, "God often humiliates his choice servants." Now I disagree with that, theologically, but I get what he was trying to say. I don't think humiliates us, God doesn't bring shame on us. He doesn't make us humiliated. But God does allow us to walk through seasons where the buffeting of the call tests us and tests our call and tests our character and tests our resolve. And there is no doubt throughout every major person in the Bible who was called by God, there was this season where, it was less about testing us in terms of our ability to stay the course, but more about allowing the call to go through a shaking for the sake of forming it and settling it as a foundation in our life. And so it's not about pass or fail you get that, it's about a stabilizing because I've walked through the shaking.

Julian:

And it's not even that God, sometimes allows it, I think life, church leadership...

Katia:

Is inevitable.

Julian:

...call, those in this leadership. It's inevitable. It's thrown at you. And so I think I'm learning to process that and walk through that.

Katia:

Yeah. I mean, I think the reality of any calling is that it is impossible. Destiny is impossible because God is inviting his children to live in the realm of the impossible, which means all of us are called to something that we cannot achieve in and of ourselves, no matter how many of our strengths play into that call, like I was saying about our kids. The reality is, what our children are called to is beyond them. And that's because calling has an element of risk and faith attached to it, because it is an impossible God who is inviting us into living in the realm with the impossible, with our call.

Katia:

That means that every single one of us is going to have to find courage in order to step into our calling. And at some point, for you who are listening, if you haven't already been in this place, you're going to go into it. That's just inevitable because impossible situations require courage to step into them. And I was talking about this on a Facebook live earlier this week, but I've just been so struck recently, reading through the epistles where Paul writes to Timothy again and again, there's this invitation to Timothy to basically believe God for his call. Fight, fan into flames, guard what's been deposited. Keep pressing on towards what's been spoken over you.

Katia:

Again and again, there's this thing of, "Timothy, you're going to have to engage with what's been spoken over you. Guard it, fight for it, fan it into flames to choose to believe it, even when other people are looking down on you because you're so young." There's this courage that Paul is kind of calling out in Timothy because what Timothy was called to was bigger than what Timothy could achieve in and of himself. And that's true for you and me. And that's certainly been my journey in the last, I'd say 10 years, is when I was younger as kind of not really so aware of all the calling would entail ready to throw myself into it. And then the more I kind of grew, the more sensible I became, the more I realized, "Wait a second, this is insane. So many of these prophetic words, if I think about the practicality of them, they are crazy. They are too big for me."

Katia:

And I went through a real season of internally battling. And I would say this season comes around again and again when I start stepping into more of the crazy promises of God. But it's the season of Am I really made for this? And the temptation is to stop believing what God said, because you start believing your own heart and the other voices around you who are saying, "That doesn't sound like very sensible option," or, "that doesn't sound like something you could do." But really, for each of us, there's going to be a [crox 00:33:17] moment for our calling, where we have to choose to believe. And I think this is more than one moment. It tends to come round again and again as you step further into the insanity of your calling, where we've got to choose to believe, "What God said about me he has equipped me for. And although I might not feel it, this is what he's spoken, I'm going to choose to go after what he's spoken over and above what I feel I am capable of."

Katia:

And so I really want to encourage you, believe God for the impossibility of your call because you were made for it.

Julian:

And this is 100% why we need community around us. The call of God can never be accomplished in and of itself without community. I find people who follow a call of God without community often end up shipwrecked. You need community to be blowing wind into your sails as it were, who are cheering on saying, "You've got this. You can do this. God has anointed you. God has put this on you." I look at the great lengths to which Jesus invites Peter into restoration for the sake of his call, in terms of feeding the sheep, as it were. Like three times he denies Jesus, three times Jesus affirms Peter's call and his love for Peter in order to bring him into a place of confidence again in the midst of disappointment. That was done over a breakfast meal. It's connected to community, it's connected to relationship.

Julian:

It is so important that we get that in us that we need to have a running tribe of people who aren't just saying all the right stuff in the sense of flattery. But who are saying, "Hey, this area of character need to be worked on because you've got a such a great call." But who don't just leave it there, who carry on to say, "Man, I love the way you preach in this day," or, the deal that you made in business in that moment or the product that you've just written or Michael, the book that you've just written and released... There's something awesome about that, where you have people coming alongside of you saying, "We're doing this together." So, actually, there is a band of brothers and sisters who believe God's word when he says a nation can be saved in a day, when he says that lives that are laid down matter and can change things around us.

Julian:

We have to have healthy community who speak health and wholeness to us, both for the good and the difficult times.

Katia:

Yeah, absolutely.

Jeshua:

That's great. I love that. What if you don't know your call? Where's a good place to begin for those people who are like, "Wait. I wasn't given a call. What did I miss? How do I start that?"

Katia:

That's a great question.

Julian:

Simplistically, we are all called primarily as sons and daughters. And actually, it seems to me that the scripture, the callings of God have less to do with the specific destiny and more to do with extending God's kingdom wherever you find yourself.

Jeshua:

That's awesome.

Julian:

So for me, I am not essentially called to be a prophet. I'm called to be a son who then begins to follow the leadings of God in the Kingdom, which happened to have unlocked the grace of a prophet on my life. But that means who I am in that grace has to impact business, has to impact family, has to impact everything. It's not like this is a separate identity. I think that sometimes when we use the term, you must have a call, we think of that in terms of a profession or in terms of a sense of, "This is my call and now I need to follow it." No, my call is to be a son. My call is to be a daughter, my call is to extend the kingdom of God wherever I am.

Julian:

However, I find myself doing that in every way and in every place. When we get that, we suddenly get to realize God is on us and then I think the second thing is personal devotion with God. Most often he'll work through our own desires. God also invites us to partner with him in the dream for our lives. And then looking for prophetic promises, what are the prophetic promises, the overarching prophetic promises tell us. When we follow those things, then generally, we stumble across our call, we stumble across our purpose. And it's in the beauty of the stumbling, it's in the beauty of discovery that we get the sense of, "okay, this is what God asked me. I'm going to run in this particular lane."

Katia:

Yeah, absolutely. I think so much of when I was younger, so much of the call of God actually came out in desires and hopes and dreams that I had. And I misunderstood what God was like in those moments. So, often when I had a dream or a desire or a picture in my mind of maybe, just maybe, maybe this is something that I could do. Literally the second after that, I think, "Oh, no, I can't possibly do that. And if it's something that's coming up in my heart, it probably isn't something that God has for me." Because I had this twisted understanding that God is going to give me or tell me to do something that is completely different to anything that I would actually want. And to be spiritual, I must follow him and lay down everything I would want.

Julian:

Sacrifice and die.

Katia:

Actually, as I've grown up and looking at how God has led me, I've realized, "Wait, there were so many moments in my childhood where I dreamed things that I'm doing now." And in all of those moments my instinct was, "Shut that down. It can't possibly be God." And now I recognize, wait, it was God. Those desires were placed in me by God and they were bubbling up and overflowing. And in those moments, God was saying, "I'm inviting you into adventure." Obviously, not every desire we have in our hearts is going to be from God. But there are good ways to weigh up what's coming up in our hearts. Good ways to weigh up, "Wait. Does this sound like an impossible kingdom adventure?" If it sounds like that, it might well be God. "Wait. Does this sound like something that might glorify God in in the places of influence that I would have?" If it does, then it might well be God.

Katia:

There there are biblical filters that you can put through on it. Does this sound like it's simple? Well, if it's sin, it's probably, definitely, not God.

Jeshua:

Pretty clear cut there.

Katia:

Pretty clear. But God gives us the ability to ask wise questions in order to decipher whether our own desires are likely to be God desires or own. And as you do these simple questions, ask yourself, is it simple? If it is, leave it alone. Ask yourself, does it sound like kingdom impossibility? If it does, then that's a really good indicator, it's probably God. Does this sound like it would bring joy to the heart of Jesus? If it does, it's probably a really good indicator that it's God. Does this sound like I would be able to love the community of believers through what I do? If it does, it's probably God. these are all questions that I'd invite you and advise you to apply as a filter to your own desires, because God, as Julian said, often uses things that we think are our own desires as ways to draw out the calling that he's put in our lives.

Katia:

And if you're saying to me, I've never been prophesied over. I'm not even sure what I want, what I was made for, then read your Bible because God often choose to prophesy to you through yourself as he speaks to you directly. He loves to speak to you directly. But also put yourself in the path of people who prophesy. I'm not talking about big state ministries. I'm talking about people in church communities who love Jesus and hear his voice, because the prophetic is not about people who stand on a platform and prophesy, but is about every believer hearing the voice of God. So say to your friends, "Please, will you be praying for me and tell me if you feel that God says anything to you for my future." Say to your pastor, "Please, will you be praying for me? If God says anything to you, I really want to be submitted to what God is calling me into."

Katia:

Put yourself in submission to those around you who love Jesus and are praying for you and see what they might have to say about the call of God over you.

Jeshua:

Wow, that's beautiful. I love that. As you're speaking, I just sense that there's people that are getting freed up of that fear that God is going to put them in the very possibly worse situation they could ever imagine. I grew up with that fear, too. But this is so freeing and this has been really, really encouraging and helpful.

Julian:

Have fun. The Lord has called me to be a first, like a five star missionary.

Jeshua:

Five star missionary?

Julian:

I have fun wherever I go. Seriously though, if the call of God in your life is not measured by some level of fun, I'm not talking about... There's always cost to the call. There's always a sense of laying some stuff down and I have been in developing world context, sleeping on floors, in jungles. I know all that stuff and I'm happy to do that, honestly. But it was never apart from a general underlying sense of adventure and fun way. It satisfied me, even in the sacrifice. There was a sense of, "Gosh, this is hard but man, I love what God's doing with me." If that bit of the, "Man, I love what God's doing," is missing, quit. Quit now because you're not having fun and the Bible is really clear that his burden is light. His yoke is easy, either that's true or it's not. And we have found that even in the most difficult transition times where we are stressed out, thinking, "Jesus, what's happening," there have been moments of laugh out loud and a sense of what an adventure, here we go. And live in that place.

Jeshua:

That was amazing. Awesome. Well, we're out of time but this was a great, great chat. Thanks for being with us.

Katia:

Thank you, guys.

Jeshua:

Thanks again for listening to this episode of Frequentsee Conversations. This was the last episode of Season one of Frequentsee Conversations. and we love feedback. So we would love to hear your thoughts on some of the episodes that you loved, some you didn't love. And if you have any suggestions for us for our next season, we would love to hear them. Questions or just ideas, please send them through to us. The way that you can do that is just through our email address. Just email admin@frequentsee.org or DM us on any of our social media platforms, Facebook or Instagram. We'd love to hear from you guys.

Jeshua:

Just because this podcast is done for a little while doesn't mean you can't still find stuff from us. We've got another podcast, Frequentsee Teachings, which you can find all over your podcasts platforms, or go to our website, frequentsee.org and click the resources tab. All the stuff in there is totally free. We've got blog posts and videos and some YouTube series, so please, please check those out. And as always, if you want a little bit more access to us, we've got our Frequentsee partnerships set up. It's just for people who give on a monthly basis. Doesn't matter how much you give. We want to give you the same access to Julian and Katia and our ministry through a private Facebook group where we do live Sessions and Q and A's. So go ahead and check that out. Find out more on our website, frequentsee.org. Click partner with us and it'll tell you all about the program. Thanks again for listening and we'll see you on the next season.